Friday, March 13, 2015

Are Black Women's Standards Too High?

UPDATE: I was going to write something really hateful about certain people right here but I deleted it seeing how vengeful people over there can be. I don't know the commentators there anymore and I think they are very disrespectful, spiteful, self-righteous, closed-minded, and hypocritical. That is not a safe space for Black women to speak, it is a place for sheep to follow in line and call names if you don't agree with them. I don't associate with people like that in real life. It's actually making me feel sick to my stomach because I'm actually disgusted with how the people commented. I think, after all this I've lost all compassion for anyone over there I don't know who those people are. There is no bone in my body who looks up to anyone over there anymore and trusts any advice they give. They are so not for me anymore safe place for Black women my ass! I really don't like people who can't think for themselves and just jump on the bandwagon, they are freaking scary. I can't support the site anymore if I don't feel safe there and I have lost all respect for the people who comment there. I feel disgusted.



This post is about a situation that has happened on the Beyond Black and White website. Apparently the site arranged for a YouTube Blogger to go on dates with 5 Black women and it was suggested that he film those dates. Well he posts videos about dating Black women (he is White) and compared to all of the hateful BW bashing videos on YouTube I was soooo glad to find them. I think that the videos are well done and I plan to watch the ones I have not seen yet.

Well apparently, the guy said he wanted to find a relationship but then changed his mind. In one of his videos he said he is also changing the direction of his channel so I guess there won't be any more interracial stuff or saying great things about BW :( Anyways, on BB&W they were seriously bashing this guy and calling him a fraud in this POST! I can understand that the women who went on dates with him could be upset but there was no reason for so much anger and name calling! It makes us look really bad and I hope that this is not the reason why he has changed the direction of the YouTube channel. This really bothers me for some reason. His channel was a good thing for BW and now people are unsubscribing because of the dating fiasco and they are writing mean comments. I think they should be thanking him for devoting all the time and effort and probably money to boost up BW. People had the nerve to complain that he went on some dates with light skinned BW because their features were not Black enough. People were actually telling him it was wrong for him to be attracted to those women and you only really like BW if you like dark skinned BW and reject light skinned BW. Your complains will not make him like you more they will probably make him like you less :(


It reminds me of how irritated I was when people were bashing Sleepy Hollow because they wanted Abbey and Ichabod to fall in love right away and they were upset that his wife came back into the picture. In both situations I feel the BW had unrealistic expectations for the relationships, they were expecting things to happen right away, and merely showcasing positive images of BW (and making them stars) was not good enough. They have no patience! SPOILER ALERT: If these women had patience and didn't start telling other BW not to watch they would have seen that Ichabod ends up killing his wife this season so she is gone! But nooo, because BW have not been treated well most of the time they expect mistreatment and they walk out feeling hurt before anything bad has even happened. Women who have never even seen anything on his channel are being told not to watch any of his videos and they are slandering him to his readers! So what if he changed his mind about the relationship? I have wanted a relationship for so long but I put off seeking one because I was moving, I was busy with school, I was busy with work, or even because it was too cold in the winter. So what? It just wasn't the right time. But to them that means he's s sociopath and a fraud. Whatever. This may be part of the reason why some people don't want to deal with you, it's easier to just focus on something or someone else who doesn't turn against them so easily.

It just seems a lot of the time that BW cannot be pleased even when they are given A GIFT for free, a gift that they have been asking for over and over! It also reminds me of some of the comments I have gotten on this blog. This blog was about my personal exploration but I made it public as A GIFT to other BW who had similar goals. It took so much time to do photo posts like THIS ONE. I had to search Google Images or Tumbler for images of BW looking a certain way and I spent (I am tempted to say wasted) many hours finding the images that demonstrated what I wanted. People have the nerve to come on here and complain that some of the women are light skinned or biracial!? If you want images of dark skinned women you are free and welcome to find them yourself and post them all over your blog or Tumbler. You will probably find it difficult because you will have to choose from what is available and time is a finite resource you may not be able to spend. You will have to wade through images of BW scowling, looking hard, mean, and masculine, and once you get past that (if you care) you fill have to find someone ATTRACTIVE in a good quality photo. Furthermore, just because you have issues with light skinned women doesn't mean I do and according to some people I am actually light skinned. I tried to show variety but I will only spend so much time looking for images and I have no problem displaying light skinned or biracial women. I am not on a mission to promote dark skin, I (was) only on a mission to promote straight BW period. I am tired of these purity standards that will only accept dark women showcased. I showed variety but you choose to ignore that and have a fit if you see light skin. If you can do better please do it yourself and stop asking people for a handout. I can understand that it won't be easy to make your own TV show but if you have time to complain to me then you have time to look for images of dark skinned BW.

I think the reason why this sort of thing irks me is because sometimes it seems like BW will not be pleased and they complain even when they get a good thing. I dare say there is some entitlement going on where you feel the TV producers, the YouTube guy, and even I owe you something and that we are "wrong" for not doing what you want. I'm tired of it. Enough with the victim mentality.

Here is my post from the BB&W site, I think I'm probably the only person in dissent about the issue:




I don't know why I am the voice of dissent on so many things that have to do with Black folks but it is what it is. Something about this reaction just sounds so extreme to me. Everyone has the right to their opinions but all the name calling and labeling seems excessive given that this account is totally one sided. I'm not taking anyone's side I'm just being empathetic and putting myself in the shoes of each party involved. These are my opinions.
1) None of us know this man's true intentions but if I was a dude and I found out a bunch of women were attracted to me I would not want to settle down if I didn't have to. Many men play the field way longer than women would like, that's just the way it is and in that regard this man is not abnormal, a sociopath, or a DBR and neither is every attractive male who doesn't want a monogamous relationship. It helps you to get through the day by thinking he's an awful guy then go ahead and do what is best for you. Just remember how much it hurts when you hear about BW being labelled and scrutinized for their choices and the names we are called when we don't give men what they want.
2) BW complain that they are not the focus of dating shows and that they are not being shown as romantic interests. This guy is doing just that and because of that he is now a sociopath? He's trying to be an entertainer, did you really expect him to fall for a woman right away and stop doing his work? Think about how many people are set up on dating shows who want a relationship...how many of those actually work out? BW are getting the attention they asked for but many of you have fairytale dreams and have unrealistic ideas about how relationships will develop (I'm no expert either) but I don't know why anyone would think a blind date would end up as a relationship. You want the attention but when things aren't perfect you don't want it. There was a post on this very site about Missy Harris wanting to be on The Bachelorette and people supported it and were disappointed when that didn't happen. Now some dude decided to give you what you want and you're pissed because he didn't want a commitment and wanted to date around more. Watch what you ask for because dudes might think twice about dating BW or encouraging it due to all of this vitriol. Please, EVERYONE, think about what the goal of this whole experiment what and Chris can tell us what he actual goal was. Was the goal to showcase interracial dates so the more dates the better or was the goal to actually fix us this man with a BW. If the goal was to showcase interracial dating then the goal was accomplished and this man should be thanked for doing it because I can't think or anyone else who is. If the goal was the second, ish happens, everyone you fix up is not going to fall in love, people change their minds, and things don't always work out.
3) Maybe he just wasn't into her. We all know great women who are single but just because we would date the girl does not mean that a specific guy would. He may very well want a relationship but he did not think he found the right girl. It happens, even to beautiful nice girls. Yo don't have to take it personally. Just because he is looking for a relationship doesn't mean he wants one with the girl you picked because he knows there is no shortage of great girls.
4) Think to yourself, is all this anger helpful to you or is it making things worse? Do you feel more open to interracial dating and more confident about your attractiveness or less? One guy did not want a relationship with one woman, no need to get so upset about that. It makes us look sort of bad. I could understand why the actual woman would feel upset, but I don't get why so many people in the comments section are. Maybe dude was a player and just wanted to get laid...it happens every day.
That's my opinion, everyone has one. Entertainment and exploitation goes hand in hand a lot of the time, for every beautiful woman there is a man who didn't want her, and just because he wasn't into her and wanted to get some does not make him the devil. If I was on the date I would be hurt and cry as I usually do though so I can understand her hurt. Fire away...
 I also want to ask the women here who think he looked suspicious from the get go...how many White dudes have you dated or spoken to on a regular basis? The guy seemed fine to me, like someone I would get along with. Are you just suspicious of this guy or do you feel that way about most White dudes anyway? It might just be me but he didn't seen too weird to me, but I like guys who are humble anyway. I feel I guess disappointed that a good thing like this could be derailed because he didn't fall in love with one woman. How MANY times have we complained on our blogs about about the BM doing negative videos about us and this one guy has done so many videos saying great things about us and showing us as romantic interests. It's so refreshing and wonderful to me. Do you really want to destroy this? Does he not deserve any praise for not going around bashing us the way BM do? In fact, I found his videos a year ago after wading through all the hate videos. Please keep the greater goal in focus. This is what you want.

35 comments:

  1. I was a little familiar with Wes before the whole dating experiment. I think the argument(s) that most of the ladies had was that he seemed disingenuous. He turned his attraction to Black women into an experiment. That he not only behaved with Christelyn Karazin in a way that seemed lascivious... He went into the whole dating game like thing saying he wanted to be in a relationship. Only to turn around (after two dates) and say that he didn't. He told Carrie (the young woman he went on a date with) that he didn't want to date her romantically when she was about to go out with friends. He also asked Carrie if she had been a prostitute during their video follow up. He told her to stand up and show the viewing audience her abs? I always dated inter racially. My boyfriend of the past 3 years is White. My first serious boyfriend was Italian. Everything in between was a mix. I don't think my expectations are "too high". But, I would never settle for less than I deserve, Honesty and respect being the first. I didn't resort to name calling. But, I can't say he didn't deserve it. Many of the ladies think that he does all this for views. Maybe. But I can say that BW that might be fed up with the way they are treated by BM sure don't want to get entangled with a WM who doesn't have their best interest at heart.

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    1. " He turned his attraction to Black women into an experiment."

      There are a whole lot of women on that site doing the same thing. He's already dated BW before though. BW on the site are doing an experiment to see if they can date non-BM and that's fine with me if they want to open up their dating pool. Anyone on YouTube is there for publicity, everyone including Chris and I don't blame her for that.

      I think she rushed in too fast and he took advantage of the situation. It's unfortunate for her, I would be upset in the same situation but I don't think anyone is a horrible person for anything they did in the situation. It is what it is. A guy changed his mind, a YouTuber wanted publicity, Chris wanted publicity and everything would have been fine if the personal stuff had not gotten mixed in there. It's a shame.

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  2. The BBW reaction to this failed dating experiment is pretty much irrational. Cristelyn screwed up, straight up, and instead of admitting it she is shaming the guy. How does it help black women to compete for the attention of an "ideal white man"? There are very few men who would not let this sort of praise and fawning go to their heads. Humble men with boundaries are unlikely to sign up for this sort of thing. So I really don't understand why people are upset. What positive traits did Wes have? Besides being white, good-looking, claiming to like black women and media savvy? The way Carrie gushed about him in the video and in her follow-up to the date, it was too much and premature. I'm not sure that she herself knows what she wants.

    I don't believe in slut-shaming. Hey, have all the hand jobs and make out sessions you want in his apartment on the 3rd date (smh). But don't turn around and start crying foul publicly when he refuses to be an Ideal Man. If you want a classy man, act like a classy lady. If you want to be fun and flirty and *wink*wink* and get your groove on, you will get a man who does the same.

    I don't want to defend this man. I think he is a tool. I would be very uncomfortable having the kind of dates Carrie had with him - even the first date it wasn't clear what exactly they had in common. I am a firm believer that in dating everyone finds their level. If you want a serious, careful man, be serious and careful yourself. You can't have it both ways.

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    1. My goal isn't to defend the guy either but I can't help if if what he did doesn't seem so bad to me. To me, as long as the guy is making BW look good I don't care if a 2-date relationship doesn't work out.

      They are making Carrie out to be way more of a victim than she is. She has gone through what women go through all the time, a guy fools himself into thinking he wants a relationship but when he gets the chance to have one he changes his mind. A guy who says he doesn;t want a relationship then goes an meets someone and falls in love and gets married. It's crappy but that's what seems to happen. She said what they did was consensual and taking off a bra is like second base, kids stuff to a lot of people given some people sleep together on the first date. She agreed to go to his place and make out so how is she a victim? She did not one, but 2 videos with the guy after all of that and it's not like he forced her.

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  3. Just as Black women should open their options, White men have the right to date as much as they want to date. It takes two to start and continue a relationship. We heard what the woman and man wanted, which are two different things. She just wasn't the one and he preferred to date more women.

    Yes, the female had her feelings hurt, but it will continue to happen in life and in dating. I am all for uplifting and empowering Black women but I refuse to fight a woman battle because a man had changed his mind about wanting to be in a relationship. My heart goes out to her because she is embarrassed. What did she expect to happen, when you up your life to the public?

    I love coming to your website and continue to look forward to each update.

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  4. To your update, I wouldn't take the behavior of those commenters to heart. I know its like 400 comments, but I get the impression it is the same 20 - 40 people responding. Out a readership of thousands, that is a minority. I do agree with you that the site is not always a "safe space" especially when it comes to posts that demand immediate support for Black Women on the site. I bet you a lot of readers disagree with how the situation is being handled, but don't want to get sucked into the drama of commenting. I for one am quite turned off by the constant reference to the author of the blog as our "leader" and "mistress" and how this is a "family." I bet you I am not the only one.

    The hypocrisy, on the other hand, is interesting to observe. If Wes had been black, and we were hearing about a black man doing all of that to a matchmaker and a black woman, BBW will have plenty to say about foolish black women not knowing their worth, letting themselves be disrespected, looking for a black savior, etc etc. Now they are angry, but they are also blind in their defensiveness. They cannot see that the knee jerk reaction to "fight for" the woman and her matchmaker, comes from the same place as the knee jerk reaction in Blackistan where people run and take up battles that are really not theirs.

    Anyway, please blog more.

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    1. Hi Happynaijawoman,

      You are more forgiving than I am at this point. Its been like that on the site for a while.

      In my personal opinion, what I would say to a friend is that if you go into business with someone (not that I'm trained in business at all) you need to look out for your reputation. If someone burns you you need to act as a professional because there are people who could do business with you in the future and they will see how you react to disagreements. You have to weigh the importance of airing your grievance and getting revenge against the possibility that you will be seen as vengeful, spiteful, and someone to be wary of doing business with because if things go wrong they will blast you all over the internet. In my opinion the latter looks worse especially for Black women. The post came off as angry and crazy as do the comments but Chris did look composed and professional in the video. There are people on the dude's site calling him a fraud and that's a big word that I would only use if money was exchanged.

      These women have to THINK, who will come out looking better after all this to people (other than BW)? In my opinion he comes out looking better. From viewing everything to most people it will look like Chris approched Wes to do a dating show because she did the promo (he wasn't even in) and she has the background of putting on things like that. It will look like she approached the guy and he changed his mind about having a relationship which is not a crime. He tried to get some, so would most dudes who have 5 women thrown at him who all think he's great. I don't blame him for trying to get what he wants even though, it would be better for my needs if men didn't do that, but how can I blame them for pursuing what they want when I go after what I want? To people (other that BW) the whole thing looks like they went crazy because the guy didn't want a relationship.

      I also find it sooooo irrational that people are complaining that he should not have gone on the dates if he wasn't looking for a relationship. Um...it was a publicity stunt and it's done all the time. If this really was a friend trying to hook up a friend then why all the publicity? Why film it? It was for the PUBLICITY and both sides were supposed to benefit. It's not a fraud to go on dates when you don't want a relationship. Every freaking dating show is like that with tons of people who go on dates for fame who are realistic about the likelihood that no relationship will come out of it. I don't get why BB&W couldn't just enjoy the publicity and try to get positive publicity for BW instead of making BW look crazy? It's like the moral police over there...you lied about wanting a relationship? You must be a psychopath. Seriously, people jump off things, fake things, go on dates, say controversial things just to get their 15 minutes so this is so freaking tame.

      The only 2 people who should feel upset about this are Chris and Carrie who went on the date. Chris should not have aired what happened in her professional transaction and Carrie should not have aired what happened on their date especially the physical stuff. It makes them both look worse than him. I think Chris's video was fine actually because she seemed calm and professional, its the post and the comments that make them look really bad. I really, really don't understand why hooking this stranger up with a woman outweighs making BW look good as potential romantic or business partners because this doesn't do any of that. It just adds to the negative publicity that already surrounds the site.

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    2. Nope. You are not the only one. I stopped commenting there quite some time ago. Too much drama and intolerance for divergent opinions.

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    3. "These women have to THINK, who will come out looking better after all this to people (other than BW)? In my opinion he comes out looking better. "

      I agree.

      Those women are playing into all the negative stereotypes about BW, especially the ones about us being angry, belligerent and emasculating. I believe that their online persona is their true personality and that is why so many of them are not successful in IR or any dating. It does not occur to them that maybe BM have rejected them because they are so mean and sour, walking around with a chip on their shoulder. They claim that the only reason they have not been successful dating BM is because of their skin color--what a joke. Do they really believe quality non-black men are desperate enough to want BW like them? Most of them have never had even one date with a non-black man. They are all living vicariously through the blog host and the few participants who are actually married to non-black men.

      They think they are hurting Wes by lashing him with their angry, rude comments but they are just showing the world that BW really are as bad as many people believe. Those women represent the worst of black womanhood, SMH.

      It is so sad because her site is the most popular BW/IR site.

      Wes did nothing wrong and he owes Carrie nothing. He has a right to reject Carrie and as many BW as he wants. In fact, he is under no obligation to be with a BW at all. That is what dating is all about.

      Carrie has serious self-esteem issues that she needs to fix. Dating is not the answer. She revealed a lot of negative things about herself (such as a drinking problem, getting kicked out of school, etc) on video to a man she has known for only 2 weeks. She seems to exercise poor judgement on a regular basis and that is definitely not appealing to quality men (I am not saying that Wes is a quality man).

      Also, what was the point of her revealing that they had been sexually intimate, as if that obligates him to make her his girlfriend or marry her. Given how easily she became intimate with a man she does not know, she should not be surprised that Wes thought she used to be a prostitute. Men compartmentalize women, so any woman who has sex early with a man will most likely ruin her chances. No amount of feminism is going to change the way most men think about women who engage in casual sex.

      Did anyone read the post Carrie wrote after her FIRST date with Wes? After only ONE date Carrie decided that Wes was the best thing that ever happened to her, SMH. Carrie is too desperate to be dating men of any race.
      Anne

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    4. There was nothing normal about how they met and how their relationship was documented. I don't think it's cool to air all your private relationship stuff online like that. Bad choice in my opinion but she said that was what she was hired to do.

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  5. The other part I don't get about the whole thing is why Carrie did a video with the guy if she was so mad? That makes me think this whole thing is overblown and she is already dating another guy so what's the bid deal. You are going to have this happen in dating. It makes them look crazy and I would think they would want to avoid that.

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    1. I suspect Christelyn's anger at Wes is based in guilt. She chose him and promoted him as a "friend" that she had thoroughly vetted. He said that he wanted a serious relationship, then acted like the typical jerk who wants to get laid with no expectations afterward.

      Frankly, when I first saw him in the introduction videos Christelyn did with him, I thought 'this guy has an unpleasant d-bag aura about him'. That is why I didn't even bother to watch the actual dating videos till the final one, where he made a choice between the women. And I probably would not have watch that one, were it not for the blog post about the anti-BW comments made by a BM on that video.

      I was not at all surprised when I heard that he told the woman he selected that he didn't want to settle down with any one woman while taking off her bra. That's the kind of thing that d-bags do. LOL. In the beginning, I was surprised that Christelyn even chose this guy, but thought that my radar must be off, because she said she knew him and that he was a good guy. I took her word for it, as did the five women who participated, but I still did not like the vibe I got from the guy. I guess I assumed that because Christelyn had chosen a great guy for herself - she's been happily married for 13 years - that she could do the same for another woman. Also, as a woman who has never been in relationship with a jerk, I believed that any woman with a good man in her life would have great instincts about men. Wrong!

      This situation does beg a question: How did this guy who turned me off from the moment I first saw him get past Christelyn? Maybe she was so excited about the joint venture that she didn't look into him thoroughly enough, I don't know. But having a fit about it after the fact is a waste of time ad makes her look unprofessional; yet, I understand why she's angered by his lack of response to her messages. It's disrespectful and says a lot about the guy's character, or lack thereof. At this point, it should be considered a lesson learned for all involved. That being said, Wes had every right to change his mind, though I suspect that he never wanted a long-term relationship to start with. And while I do feel bad for the woman he chose, she should be grateful that things did not go further with this man. If she'd slept with him she'd feel even worse than she already does.

      It must be very embarrassing for her, especially because he asked her (publicly) if she was a prostitute, but I hope the women paying attention will learn something from this situation. For one, stop trying to turn a handful of dates into a relationship. Relationships, like trust and mutual admiration, are built over time. I believe that women should date (not seep with) multiple men at that same time and separate the wheat from the chaff. Dating one person at a time usually leads to getting emotionally involved with that one person before there's anything there.
      Just my two cents.

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    2. Anonymous, you could be right that Chris just feels bad about her choice. I just saw the guy like any other YouTuber but I didn't think he was awful or anything. He is socially awkward and knows it. He just asks what comes to his mind and that could be a good thing or a bad thing depending on who you talk to. Chris and Carrie both met the guy multiple times, Carrie said they talked on the phone multiple times so they didn't see anything wrong with him and neither did I. Frankly, the guy lied about wanting a relationship in order to get publicity and Chris lied about him being her friend...to get publicity. I don't have a problem with either of them doing that. Chris has admitted to using offensive titles to get views and to keep her site going, this is all along the same lines. The whole thing was called The Dating Game so why were the women so serious?

      Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought Carrie said to the guy something like, I have some really bad things in my past (i.e., the drinking and pot) and when she said bad things he asked if she was a prostitute because of that. When she said really bad past he guessed a really bad past. I would have laughed and said not that bad. I wouldn't have assumed that meant he thinks I;m a prostitute, he just said the worst thing that came to his mind. People are acting like he asked her that out of the blue.

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    3. Carrie did (foolishly) say that there were "bad things" in her past. That's the kind of thing you mention 3-4 months down the line, and in private, so obviously she has very poor judgement. However, I stand by my take on Wes. I am one of the few women I know who has never dated a guy who turned out to be a prick, and my husband is one of the most thoughtful, kind and amazing men I know. I've always had great instincts about people (especially in person) and I can sense bad news a mile off; Wes gave off a vibe that I always get from d-bags in real life. But I do appreciate that my idea of a d-bag might be someone else's dreamboat. I have friends who've been in love with guys I would never have given the time of day to. LOL

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  6. Hello Elegance!
    I happened to have read your comments on this topic on BB&W with great interest and wanted to take a moment to express my thoughts if I may.
    First, I personally felt you conducted yourself and communicated your thoughts and opinions with a great deal of class, dignity and respect. I am most thoroughly impressed and I found myself sympathizing with you in that regard. I do indeed understand where you are coming from and you have my admiration as I read onward. If nothing else, please know that your efforts were indeed noticed and appreciated.
    As for my familiarity with BB&W, I used to frequent the site under the name Savage Tango and became quite involved with the goings on around the place. Unfortunately I deleted my account there and no longer participate.
    See, from where I was sitting I saw a whole lot of Ladies spending a whole lot more time talking about the things they didn't like than talking about the things they did like. That vibe doesn't really do it for me so I decided to go sit somewhere else.
    Anyway, I saw this link to your blog on your user name over there and read your poignant thoughts over here and I wanted to let you know someone out there appreciates what you said and how you said it.
    Thank you for your time and I wish you all the best!
    Gary B.

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    1. Hi Gary,

      It's a shame that the site turned you off but I can understand if you don't want to expose yourself to negativity. Thank you for your kind words. I wish they would stop talking about how BM treat them if they don't want to date them. Just make it a BM free site. But they want to vent and talk about it because it gets hits.

      I think that it will be great for the site to actually get more "Raimbeaus" to write for the site, act as allies, and create partnerships but if they were to see that debacle with Wes they would be turned off. It looks like if you have a partnership with the site and things don't go well they will trash you and that is not professional. If she wants another partnership there's a good chance they won't find out about this and that would be a good thing. I don't want to see the message about BW silenced by I am not liking the way people are acting over there in the comments. I don't get people who like to put others down all the time and just relish in name calling and trying to belittle people. I don't associate with people like that. I don't need to be that way in my life so I'm wondering why they need to be that way.

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  7. Hi Elegance I can not read your whole blog post just yet as I will be in class soon, BUT I wanted to say THANK YOU for coming back. I have been awaiting you and a few other lovely feminine Black women bloggers to post again. I truly do miss your blog posts ^_^

    I glossed over the fiasco about the BBW incident with Wes and I will come back later to give my two cents as a casual lurker.

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  8. Honest to god, if this happened to my sister, I'd be mad at her, not the guy.

    My sister and I would have some SERIOUS conversations about boundaries, red flags, personal responsibility and not getting emotionally ahead of oneself. I fully expect people to be capable of pushing boundaries and gaming a system to their advantage. NO WAY would I let my sister go out there without understanding what her role is in protecting herself.

    Also, I would be checking the reciepts of any guy I'm setting up with the ladies I know. For real: if I recommend someone, I've let the lady know that I think he passes muster.

    I can see people being irritated, but that level of anger is unnecessary. That level of anger should be reserved for when people are coercive and abusive, like the guy tried to assault her.

    But dudes running weak game and the girl falling for it? Where I come from, that's her responsibility to be less gullible (and the responsibility of the older women of her family or acquaintance to teach her not to be that way.) Especially if people are going to get to the point where they're getting physical.

    I saw a lot of comments about not being too critical because it's an "uplifting community" but in my opinion, it's not uplifting someone to just give commisseration and no strategies to protect oneself in the future.

    From the beginning, I thought the whole thing sounded off from both sides. It just sounded very much like a publicity stunt. I don't know anyone who seriously puts themselves out there like that to be or meet a "soul mate", unless they have exhausted all of their options. I felt like both of them were too attractive to treat this as a viable option to meet a quality mate. So I expected this to either be all in good fun, or a trainwreck waiting to happen.

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  9. Hi Elegance, I missed you! More posts, please, i discovered blogs about black woen thanks to this blog 2 years ago; i miss your posts

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  10. It was all for publicity. People today realize that being famous on youtube translates to fame in the real world. So people do things to attract attention, it's all for the fame. Most people who do things in front of a camera do it for the fame.

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  11. Hmm...where do I start?
    First off, I just want to say that that Wes guy creeped me out from the get go. And it's not about him doing a dating show to get views. No, I actually came across his channel long before him and Chris decided to embark on their little project, and something about him really turned me off. Maybe it's just me never trusting bald white men but that's neither here nor there.
    I was surprised when Chris put up the video talking about the whole situation and voicing her disappointment. So of course I went to his channel because I wanted to see who this guy was, and lo and behold it's the same guy that gave me the weird vibes from watching his videos a while back.
    First of all, the guy is nothing special. I saw the video that he made with the chick and you could literally sense the tension and awkwardness between them. I didn't see much chemistry. All I saw was a guy not willing to continue dating a woman he wasn't attracted to to begin with, and a very desperate black woman. Carrie is not the most attractive black girl out there and Wes knows this which is why he changed his mind. I believe that he knew from the very beginning that it wasn't going to work out, but he went ahead and documented the dates anyway because the whole thing was advertised and a lot of people had expectations. To me she looks like a 5 in the looks department, which is quite average. And I'm being generous. She also looks older than her actual age. She says she's 27 but she looks 35. I am 36 and I look younger than she does.
    Another thing I find weird was how in the beginning of the video the guy couldn't stop stressing about how well she spoke! And you can see her looking at the camera like Wtf?? Like was he expecting her to be talking all hood or something? That in itself is a red flag to me.
    Let's face it, most of christalyns followers are desperate black women who most likely haven't had dates in ages, let alone relationships.
    Carrie's desperation and poor judgement is obvious. What kind of woman goes out on a couple dates with a guy only to allow him to get to the point where he is taking off her bra?? God alone knows how far they went, they could have had actual sex for all we know, but she's probably trying to make it seem like they just made out. Or he probably didn't like what he saw under the bra. Some men will change their mind about a women after seeing what she looks like naked. We will never know what actually happened between the two of them.
    Now the next point I'm gonna make, I know a lot of people won't like. Why is it that Chris main focus is on BW/WM pairings? There are so many men of different races that black women can date and marry. Hell I'm married to a mixed race man. Before I got married I was no stranger to dating outside of my race long before I even knew who christelyn was. And to be honest, I've never had much luck with the white men I've dated. They all turned out to be major douche bags. Now I'm not saying all white men are jerks, let's not get it twisted. But if black women want to open their options when it comes to dating, then we shouldn't limit ourselves to just white men.

    Another thing that bothers me a lot about BBW, is the fact that if you're light skin, your comments are ignored. No one gives you the time of day and your opinion doesn't even matter. This has been my experience as a member. Granted I'm no longer a member and haven't been in a while but I doubt much has changed. Why is it that they have issues with light skin women, yet they are marrying and having children by white men. Isn't it obvious that their daughters are most likely gonna end up being light skin?? They complain about light skin women but they're sitting at home raising those same light skin women. This really confuses me but what ever makes them happy is fine by me.

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    1. Sorry I ran out of characters.
      So anyways, as I was saying, Chris has been at this game for so long, yet her following hasn't been growing. She is obviously not reaching out to a lot of black women, and she sure as hell sing reaching a lot of white men. So her collaboration with Wes comes as no surprise. The sole purpose of the dating show was for Chris and Wes to get more followers. They were never friends and we all know that she never vetted him. So they basically used those women and set them up for failure. Chris is just as guilty as Wes when it comes to Carries feelings getting hurt. The above video was painful to watch. I hate the fact that she is talking about her alcohol and drug abuse, most of which happened in the past. It would only makes her look bad.

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    2. "Now the next point I'm gonna make, I know a lot of people won't like. Why is it that Chris main focus is on BW/WM pairings? There are so many men of different races that black women can date and marry. Hell I'm married to a mixed race man."

      Chris and the other BWE/IR bloggers focus on WM for a few reasons. First, WM are the single largest group of men in the United States, Canada and the European countries where most of the BWE followers reside. Second, after BM, WM have the highest number of marriages with BW. The number of marriages between BW and Hispanic,Asian, Arab and other men is very small compared to the number of WM married to BW. Third, WM are the wealthiest and most powerful men on the planet and a typical BW would benefit most from marrying a white man. Fourth, many non-white men (Asian, Arabs etc) have SERIOUS colorism issues (even worse than whites) and cultural/religious baggage that will prevent them from MARRYING a BW. They simply are not looking to bring home a dark skin BW with strong West African features.

      I think the biggest problem with IR dating is that dating does not invariably lead to marriage. Many white and non-black men will happily "date" BW and even have long-term relationships with them, but they don't end up marrying them. That is one ugly truth about IR dating that none of the BWE bloggers or followers will admit. Some of those women have been "dating" non-black men for years, even before the BWE blogs came along.

      We live in a racist and colorist society that. There are millions of BW who want to get married. Does anyone really believe that white and other non-black men will abandon other women by the millions in order to marry BW? We can't ignore the non-black women who also want non-black men of all races. Those women have an advantage of NOT being black or only part black. Dark skin with West African features is not the standard of beauty, not even in West Africa where they are obsessed with skin bleaching and hair weaves.There is no shortage of women and in fact, there are more women than men.

      The sad truth is, many BW are aging out of the marriage market simply because there are not enough non-black men who want to marry BW. Also, many of the non-black men who are willing to marry BW are of the same low quality as the BM that they are running from. Where I live, IR marriages with BW is almost zero, even though I know lots of BW who are dating IR.



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  12. To my opinion, they have issues with non AA BW too now, especially african women; the public of BBW has changed a lot

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  13. "Now the next point I'm gonna make, I know a lot of people won't like. Why is it that Chris main focus is on BW/WM pairings? There are so many men of different races that black women can date and marry.But if black women want to open their options when it comes to dating, then we shouldn't limit ourselves to just white men."

    I totally agree.

    This is one of the lessons African American women have a problem understanding.They cannot see that there is nothing stopping white men from dating and marrying them.They also need to look at the fact that white men are complicit in rigging this system against black women and pushing white women so way above, thus creating an environment where the weakest man, black men find it fascinating, simply to be with these women.

    Just because some white men date and marry black women, does not mean this is, or will be a collective thing on the part of white men.This is why black women bloggers(who are into interracial relationships) and are so bent out in condemning others as enemies, especially white women, are foolish.
    There is equal or even more negativity against black women online coming from white men in comparison black men.
    I read all the time how they(black females interracialists) often attack everyone under the sun, except white men. Hello??!! They need to catch a clue. In the USA, a a large number of non-black/non- white men are simply looking for good women to marry and have children with.And many black women are part of this group. Duh! To put all eggs in one basket, similar to the grand error they have made with black men is not wise.

    " Isn't it obvious that their daughters are most likely gonna end up being light skin?? They complain about light skin women but they're sitting at home raising those same light skin women. This really confuses me but what ever makes them happy is fine by me."

    All this proves is that a good many of them are simply not ready and it also comes across as envy, jealousy and resentment.And this envy/resentment/jealousy will be a carry over when they are raising their daughters and have serious ramifications.
    African American women need to stop seeing themselves as a collective because they are not.
    The experiences of the collective black women are always never the same.In the wide USA,with its diverse regions, black women lead different lives.In some areas, black women come across many different people. All black women need to do is expand their friends, allies and connections into other people.
    White women, light skinned women, Asian women ,Latino women, biracial women, are not black women's enemies.
    And the vetting rubric extends to all men, not only white men.
    I wish black women the best.

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  14. Are you going to post more articles (esp. the ones on femininity and such)? I adore your blog ^ - ^

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  15. Loving your pictures and the genuine, honest way you have put your story across - you're an inspiration and I am following your journey - awesome work!

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  16. Some of these comments need to be edited because they are more insulting than they need to be. As far as Carrie is concerned, in a recent post she has described a sexual encounter in detail, using her real name on a blog so I don't feel the need to defend that practice

    I have to say that the recent anonymous comment rubbed me the wrong way and almost sounds trolling. Please don't come to Black women saying we may date White men for years but they won't marry us when there are even larger numbers of BW doing that with Black men and not getting married either. Plenty of BM string along multiple BW, having babies and refusing to marry them.

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  17. "Those women have an advantage of NOT being black or only part black. Dark skin with West African features is not the standard of beauty, not even in West Africa where they are obsessed with skin bleaching and hair "

    My opinion: Which Power, above or below have designated Anonymous- May 26, an authority on Universal Female Standard of Beauty?

    My opinion: In the USA, a a large number of non-black men are simply looking for good women to marry and have children with.And many black women are part of this group. To put all eggs in one basket, similar to the grand error they have made with black men is not wise.

    I have noticed where I live that many younger black American women are now dating and marrying Latino men.These younger African American women are nothing like the older black women who rarely would even look at non- African American men.

    This is why I am so proud and happy for Janet Jackson. She placed her joy and security above everything else . She is married to a man who loves her and she does not care what anyone thinks.This is how black women are supposed to think.
    I am also seeing a lot of interracial couples of black women with non-black men; and I am also seeing many black women socializing in groups with diverse people, something that I have always recommended.
    Anonymous of May 26, is the type of individual that is in abundance among black Americans. He/She exists to simply sap black women's energy and self esteem.Really he/she is a coward and has no real power over black women and this they know it pretty well. I have one last thing to say:

    African Women are Beautiful
    Black Caribbean Women are Beautiful
    Black Women from Latin America are Beautiful
    Black Women are Beautiful
    Afro Descendants Women are Beautiful

    I wish black women all the best.

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  18. African American Women are Beautiful.

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  19. Every now and then, I find myself taking a break from that site, right about when that Dating Game was getting started. I just started revisiting and found this catastrophe. I shouldn't laugh. I really shouldn't. But you know how sometimes you have to remind yourself that the people on the Internet are NOT your friends? Even if we share a similar stated interest.

    Yeah, that's what the moderator forgot. God Bless her, she was well-meaning.

    That and with the online dating thing, it really is 'caveat emptor' (let the buyer beware!). Matchmaking is not an easy thing, which is why dating sites spent a chunk on software to try and crunch the variables in lieu of vetting. I'm assuming The moderator had no such software to hand, so these young women shouldn't take it anymore seriously than when a co-worker sets them up on a blind date.
    Maria cummings made some interesting points on the growth of that site. I won't knock anyone for wanting to grow their brand, that seems to be the rational thing to do for someone who is doing this full-time. Blog, then book, exercise DVD, then collabs, dating show on youtube. It's a lot of hard work to constantly find content to keep em coming and the view rates attractive for advertisers. So the time involved in properly vetting either the young man or the young lady, may not seem worth it. Sometimes fudging it works. This time it didn't.
    And that may be where this moderator's righteous indignation comes from. I find it disingenuous to rail against men who want to use BW to build up a harem, when she served this man five young women on a platter.

    Anyways, glad to see you "back" if only to vent.

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    1. To answer your question about high standards: no. It takes courage to hold on to them in the face of ridicule and abuse that BW often face from those around them.
      On that note, here's a link to a TED talk that you may find interesting: The Mathematics of Love.
      http://www.ted.com/talks/hannah_fry_the_mathematics_of_love

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  20. Ha! Pshawww...If anything regarding quite a lot of BW over the past 25+ years sadly their standards aren't high enough....

    I mean over the past 20 years or so, BW just accept so-called lame 'house dates' from guys who never take them out anywhere, the BW cook for these guys just like that right away all the time without the guys ever having to demonstrate anything chivalrous or never providing anything for the BW and if the BW does go out to eat with a guy she's the one always reaching for her wallet and never the guy.

    BW for a couple of decades who have never or who have barely ever received any courting from guys...? What the...?? And people call those so-called 'standards' 'high'???....Um.....

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  21. Ha! Pshawww...If anything regarding quite a lot of BW over the past 25+ years sadly their standards aren't high enough....

    I mean over the past 20 years or so, BW just accept so-called lame 'house dates' from guys who never take them out anywhere, the BW cook for these guys just like that right away all the time without the guys ever having to demonstrate anything chivalrous or never providing anything for the BW and if the BW does go out to eat with a guy she's the one always reaching for her wallet and never the guy.

    BW for a couple of decades who have never or who have barely ever received any courting from guys...? What the...?? And people call those so-called 'standards' 'high'???....Um.....

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